AR15.Com Archives
 CZ V22 Upper Questions
cow_commander  [Member]
3/13/2008 3:39:53 AM
1. Since it's a rimfire upper, these don't use the buffer spring on the stock, right? So the back of the V22 upper is completely sealed?

2. Is that cylinder handguard on it removable and replaceable with any railed carbine-length handguard?

3. This just drops into any lower receiver, no modifications necessary or will there be issues with certain lowers and parts?

4. Is it picky with ammo? Will it work with certain types of .22LR like subsonic ones such as the Aquila?

5. At around $250, is this the cheapest rimfire upper available out there?

Thanks for any answers you can provide.
310Cadet  [Team Member]
3/13/2008 11:04:03 AM
1. Correct - no buffer needed or used. Mine doesn't have one. The back of the upper has a part that seals it, but its removable if you take out a pin for cleaning.

2. I fitted a Midwest Industries carbine length FF rail to my V22 this morning

3. It should work with all lowers. The only thing I'm aware of is that it can be picky with some competition triggers as the springs in them may be too strong for the recoiling bolt to reset. I've got a standard trigger at the moment and it works fine with that.

4. I'm currently just using minimags, but I know people who've had their V22s for a while (and have been run in) that can cycle standard velocity and sub-sonics. I'm hoping mine will do the same when I've put a thousand high velocity through it - it may work already, I just don't have anything other high velocity at the moment.

5. I paid the equivalent of around $1000 for my V22 upper in the UK, so $250 certainly looks like a good price to me !
Andrewh  [Member]
3/13/2008 3:34:35 PM
I have mine on a RRA lower. Standard trigger.
It does not like anything less than full power rounds. Sometimes fails to feed. doesn't pull back fully.
Some people have trimmed the springs and gotten it to work with lower power ammo. I am not willing to do that.

Yes it is fully sealed. Pull a pin to take it down to clean.
IcarusY625  [Team Member]
3/13/2008 5:06:34 PM
Had my V22 for 5 years now. Started with high velocity only at first. After 2000-2500 rounds it would cycle quality sub-sonics (loves Eley pistol!). It's never liked heavily waxed rounds. Put a JP adjustable trigger in, back to high-velocity only so had to re-install factory hammer spring for subs. Darn. Couple of thou rounds later, tried the JP hammer spring again and it worked!. Broke the original firing pin @3000 rounds. SGC replacemnet and still going strong after @7000 rounds. Only probs have been mag related (crappy Ceiner pos), and crappy ammo. Now have SGC and BDM mags and all is well, and it's still my most fun gun....

Oh, and it takes all the usual AR after market goodies..........



Mine's very modest, though. No zombies over here.......................
FightingHellfish  [Team Member]
3/13/2008 5:19:57 PM
Although the V22 will run with out a buffer, I believe that it is intended to run with the buffer installed.

At the rear of the V22 upper is a small captive pin that runs parrallel to the bolt and has about 5/16 of an inch of movement. When the bolt is all the way to the rear it forces that pin backwards and compresses the buffer spring about 5/16 of an inch.

When you manually charge a V22 with the buffer installed you can feel the extra spring tension at the rear of the bolt cycle as the buffer spring compresses.

I'm not sure if the function of that pin is to act as a shock absorber and slow down the bolt at the rear of it's travel, or if it is intended as an accelerator to give it a little more oomph in the forward direction, but it seems to indicate that the V22 is designed to operate with the buffer in the lower.





AND..... It costs a $1000 for a V22 upper in the UK?
cow_commander  [Member]
3/13/2008 9:15:23 PM
Thanks for the info guys, more pics please, I want to see what these actually look like.
IcarusY625  [Team Member]
3/14/2008 8:28:55 AM

Originally Posted By FightingHellfish:
Although the V22 will run with out a buffer, I believe that it is intended to run with the buffer installed.

At the rear of the V22 upper is a small captive pin that runs parrallel to the bolt and has about 5/16 of an inch of movement. When the bolt is all the way to the rear it forces that pin backwards and compresses the buffer spring about 5/16 of an inch.

When you manually charge a V22 with the buffer installed you can feel the extra spring tension at the rear of the bolt cycle as the buffer spring compresses.

I'm not sure if the function of that pin is to act as a shock absorber and slow down the bolt at the rear of it's travel, or if it is intended as an accelerator to give it a little more oomph in the forward direction, but it seems to indicate that the V22 is designed to operate with the buffer in the lower.





AND..... It costs a $1000 for a V22 upper in the UK?


Nearly, just an upper will set you back@$800..........At the rear of the V22 upper is a small captive pin that runs parrallel to the bolt and has about 5/16 of an inch of movement. When the bolt is all the way to the rear it forces that pin backwards and compresses the buffer spring about 5/16 of an inch.

..mine just has a solid block which houses the back end of the guide rods. When that block is in place and located by the crosspin that retains it, it is completely isolated from the buffer in the stock tube, or have I misunderstood you?



Tomtbo  [Life Member]
3/14/2008 11:14:00 AM

Originally Posted By IcarusY625:

Originally Posted By FightingHellfish:
Although the V22 will run with out a buffer, I believe that it is intended to run with the buffer installed.

At the rear of the V22 upper is a small captive pin that runs parrallel to the bolt and has about 5/16 of an inch of movement. When the bolt is all the way to the rear it forces that pin backwards and compresses the buffer spring about 5/16 of an inch.

When you manually charge a V22 with the buffer installed you can feel the extra spring tension at the rear of the bolt cycle as the buffer spring compresses.

I'm not sure if the function of that pin is to act as a shock absorber and slow down the bolt at the rear of it's travel, or if it is intended as an accelerator to give it a little more oomph in the forward direction, but it seems to indicate that the V22 is designed to operate with the buffer in the lower.





AND..... It costs a $1000 for a V22 upper in the UK?


Nearly, just an upper will set you back@$800..........At the rear of the V22 upper is a small captive pin that runs parrallel to the bolt and has about 5/16 of an inch of movement. When the bolt is all the way to the rear it forces that pin backwards and compresses the buffer spring about 5/16 of an inch.

..mine just has a solid block which houses the back end of the guide rods. When that block is in place and located by the crosspin that retains it, it is completely isolated from the buffer in the stock tube, or have I misunderstood you?




Apparently, CZ made different models. The one I have is precisely as FightingHellfish described, so there must be an early and a late version.
FightingHellfish  [Team Member]
3/14/2008 11:55:11 AM
Heres a photo with the pin extended, as it is when the bolt is to the rear, compressing the buffer spring a little bit:



When the bolt is forward the buffer pushes the pin forward to this position:




Here are some gratuitous pics of my CZ: I try to configure it to mimic whatever centerfire AR I am shooting the same day:


Carry handle irons:


BUIS and SPOT red dot:



1.25 - 4.5 illuminated reticle optic


IcarusY625  [Team Member]
3/14/2008 2:42:44 PM
Ah! Mine definitely doesn't have that pin. Does yours still run on twin guide rods?, as it looks like the same line for your pin..............I think, have to strip it now...
Andrewh  [Member]
3/14/2008 2:56:20 PM
Yep, mine has that pin too, and it has twin guide rods and springs inside. They are a bit offset like caddy corner to each other.
Don't remember how they line up to that bolt.
Mine I think was an early model as well.
Cboyer  [Member]
3/15/2008 12:01:03 PM
"Ok" not to high jack but I have not seen these uppers advertised for some time and I'm now ready to get a 22Lr upper( also considering Spikes). Is there a site where I can find the V22.

Thanks.
Dan-The-Man  [Member]
3/15/2008 1:09:08 PM

Originally Posted By cow_commander:
Thanks for the info guys, more pics please, I want to see what these actually look like.


V22 at the bottom, mine has that little recoil pin

FightingHellfish  [Team Member]
3/15/2008 1:09:11 PM
I'm not sure if they are currently imported.

The only thing I dislike about my CZ is the side charging handle instead of the normal AR charging system. It does seem like a fair percentage of them came from the factory needing work (surprising from CZ) but a good one will out shoot any Ceiner based .22 I've seen. However, it seems like all the .22 AR manufacturers have had that type of trouble.

You could probably find a used one somewhere. IIRC, CCS was considering importing them.
FightingHellfish  [Team Member]
3/15/2008 1:10:48 PM
Dan, tell us how you got that M4 type barrel on your CZ upper.
Dan-The-Man  [Member]
3/15/2008 1:15:28 PM
I bought it like that, the previous owner had it machined down to M4 profile from the standard V22 profile, just makes it look that bit more authentic, especially with the addition of the front sight.
I fitted UTG handguards as in this pic below....great for lasers and forward vertical grips

polik6887  [Member]
3/15/2008 4:55:34 PM
I love my CZ, now that it has been reworked by ADCO. before I had constant failure to eject.

they modified the ejector bar, and bolt so that the ejection is now positive, and reliable.

still needs a reduced power spring on the hammer. one other thing is that I have a notched hammer right now and it has been hitting the firing pin unevenly and worn a little notch in it. I have a DPMS hammer on the way, and I plan on grinding off the rear turning it into a "speed hammer" for more positive ignition (the reduced power spings are sometimes too light)

mine has the little pin on the back to hit the buffer.

where can I buy another one of these for 250$? a buddy of mine wants one.

a local shop has one for 400$ , I only paid 200$ for mine.
shrikefan  [Team Member]
3/15/2008 9:01:31 PM

Originally Posted By Dan-The-Man:
I bought it like that, the previous owner had it machined down to M4 profile from the standard V22 profile, just makes it look that bit more authentic, especially with the addition of the front sight.
I fitted UTG handguards as in this pic below....great for lasers and forward vertical grips

i253.photobucket.com/albums/hh66/sundancekid_02/rifles.jpg


Nice! What is the story on the mag in the CZ?
Dan-The-Man  [Member]
3/16/2008 5:22:45 AM
It was just a .223 mag stuck in for the photo, BUT the guys here have been cutting down the 10 round mags and inserting them into the 30 round .223 mags to improve the aesthetics so they would look exactly like the photo.
Not worth doing now since BDM make superb full body mags - which I'm using.
ARthuri  [Member]
3/16/2008 5:53:17 AM

Not worth doing now since BDM make superb full body mags - which I'm using.


Are there different BDM mags for V22 or are they just BDM´s ciener mags?
Dan-The-Man  [Member]
3/16/2008 6:01:59 AM
BDM make a specific mag for the V22 as the Ciener ones only work with Ciener conversion kits.
ThatsMrdrew2u  [Member]
3/16/2008 7:15:47 AM
does anyone know if you can still buy the CZ V22 Upper? if so where ..
IcarusY625  [Team Member]
3/16/2008 7:41:22 AM

Originally Posted By ThatsMrdrew2u:
does anyone know if you can still buy the CZ V22 Upper? if so where ..


Here in little 'ol England, but it will set you back $800.............

...and I thought I was Mr Drew.............................
cow_commander  [Member]
3/19/2008 3:52:04 PM
Thanks for the info guys, I found a used V22 as well, it also has a pin on the back. However, I can't figure out how to get the old handguard off, where are the screws on it?

shrikefan  [Team Member]
3/19/2008 5:09:35 PM
Twist it, it will come off. You might need a strap wrench. Look for signs of loc-tite.

ETA - It looks to be a standard ar15 upper thread. I think some other members have posted that they used standard ar parts on these.
redline  [Member]
3/19/2008 9:10:56 PM
dont forget lefty loosy. i would like to know who threads barrels for flash hiders and such that is good.
dogvet  [Member]
3/19/2008 9:29:43 PM
Please enlighten me about the BDM mags and where to find some!!
All I have is the 10 rounders that came with it, and that takes the fun out of shooting this gun

Thanks!
shrikefan  [Team Member]
3/19/2008 9:43:26 PM

Originally Posted By dogvet:
Please enlighten me about the BDM mags and where to find some!!
All I have is the 10 rounders that came with it, and that takes the fun out of shooting this gun

Thanks!


Try Black Dog Machine or CCS - Caliber Conversion Supply
redline  [Member]
3/19/2008 10:04:04 PM
http://www.conversioncs.com/ or http://www.blackdogmachinellc.net/ first time to try and post a link hope it works.
shrikefan  [Team Member]
3/19/2008 10:07:35 PM

Originally Posted By redline:
www.conversioncs.com/ or www.blackdogmachinellc.net/ first time to try and post a link hope it works.


Try it like this.
cow_commander  [Member]
3/20/2008 1:59:28 AM

Originally Posted By shrikefan:
Twist it, it will come off. You might need a strap wrench. Look for signs of loc-tite.


You sure about that? I am, I've twisted this as hard as I can and it still won't budge one bit! Even had this held onto a vice grip with no luck whatsoever, how the heck did you guys remove this?! My arms hurt so bad now trying to twist it off.
IcarusY625  [Team Member]
3/20/2008 2:56:58 AM

Originally Posted By cow_commander:

Originally Posted By shrikefan:
Twist it, it will come off. You might need a strap wrench. Look for signs of loc-tite.


You sure about that? I am, I've twisted this as hard as I can and it still won't budge one bit! Even had this held onto a vice grip with no luck whatsoever, how the heck did you guys remove this?! My arms hurt so bad now trying to twist it off.


Might be loc-tited, not that I've ever known one need it. Try some heat.
Andrewh  [Member]
3/20/2008 10:12:56 AM
It is threaded on. It unscrews. I can do it by hand, but a rubber pipe strap, or a small oil filter wrench if you don't care about screwing up the finish will take it off.
CCS  [Dealer]
3/20/2008 11:14:34 AM

Originally Posted By ThatsMrdrew2u:
does anyone know if you can still buy the CZ V22 Upper? if so where ..


**SOLD**I have a used CZ V-22 upper in good condition w/ a 10rd CZ factory mag available for sale. The price is negotiable, depending upon how many BDM V-22 hi-cap mags you wish to purchase along with it. Please e-mail me if you're interested.

Thanks,

Dan
Conversion Caliber Supply, LLC
info@ConversionCS.com
Sader762  [Team Member]
3/20/2008 4:21:34 PM

Originally Posted By cow_commander:

Originally Posted By shrikefan:
Twist it, it will come off. You might need a strap wrench. Look for signs of loc-tite.


You sure about that? I am, I've twisted this as hard as I can and it still won't budge one bit! Even had this held onto a vice grip with no luck whatsoever, how the heck did you guys remove this?! My arms hurt so bad now trying to twist it off.



Not to be an ass, but are you turning the right way?

Left to loosen.
Kaptain_Haddock  [Member]
5/30/2008 7:58:08 AM
Hi, sorry for digging up this somewhat old topic. But I would like to know if it's possible to put normal handguards on the V22. Nothing with rails or such, just a good ole handguard like you get on M4s and M16s
VASCAR2  [Member]
5/30/2008 11:26:36 AM
You can put a standard hand guard on a V-22. The biggest issue is the front sight assembly. The Delta ring, weld spring area is not an issue as the barrel sits in the upper the same as a standard AR. You'll probably need a standard barrel nut but my memory is failing me. The biggest issue is the the length between the upper receiver and the gas block on the V-22 barrel. The V-22 barrel maybe a different diameter than a standard AR barrel. If the barrel is a different diameter your going to have to stay with the front gas block which came on the V-22 barrel. Otherwise your going to have to modify the new front sight to fit the barrel or turn the barrel down to fit the sight. Also most front sights are held in place by taper pins. If you go to a standard fixed front sight base you will have to drill holes in the barrel for the taper pins or buy a front sight which is attached by screws. The gas block has a set screw in the bottom of the barrel and the bottom of the barrel is relieved where the gas block is supposed to sit. You will need a front hand guard cap which you can attach to the gas block with a small screw. Its possible your going to have to notch the bottom of the barrel in a different location for gas block to hold the new hand guards in the correct position. You'll probably have to drill and tap the receiver side of the gas block to hold the hand guard cap in place. If you look at the pictures of 22 lr AR's I believe there is a picture of a V-22 with the standard hand guard installed. There was a post on this sight a couple months ago where someone installed a standard carbine style grip on his V-22. I think he used the original gas block and a clamp on fixed front sight. I thought it looked pretty good. I hope this helps................good luck.
FightingHellfish  [Team Member]
5/30/2008 4:01:22 PM

Originally Posted By Kaptain_Haddock:
Hi, sorry for digging up this somewhat old topic. But I would like to know if it's possible to put normal handguards on the V22. Nothing with rails or such, just a good ole handguard like you get on M4s and M16s


I converted mine. I retained the factory sight block, but you have to shorten or move it. Here's a post about it:

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=15&t=372166
edwin247  [Team Member]
5/30/2008 5:29:51 PM

Originally Posted By FightingHellfish:
Although the V22 will run with out a buffer, I believe that it is intended to run with the buffer installed.

At the rear of the V22 upper is a small captive pin that runs parrallel to the bolt and has about 5/16 of an inch of movement. When the bolt is all the way to the rear it forces that pin backwards and compresses the buffer spring about 5/16 of an inch.

When you manually charge a V22 with the buffer installed you can feel the extra spring tension at the rear of the bolt cycle as the buffer spring compresses.

I'm not sure if the function of that pin is to act as a shock absorber and slow down the bolt at the rear of it's travel, or if it is intended as an accelerator to give it a little more oomph in the forward direction, but it seems to indicate that the V22 is designed to operate with the buffer in the lower.



SGC in the UK suggests the removal that pin, therefore no buffer would be needed. That is probably why people in the UK doesn't have the pin as most get the uppers from SGC.

There is a member here on ARFCOM that actually designed the upper for CZ.....he was pretty helpful with information.