AR15.Com Archives
 Colt 4 x 20 Scope
peepshowal  [Member]
5/7/2007 8:41:23 AM
When were these made?

This one on ebay (not mine) looks nice cgi.ebay.com/Colt-4-x-20-Scope_W0QQitemZ250111464372QQihZ015QQcategoryZ31714QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

What is the general price range these are selling for?
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burnm193  [Member]
5/7/2007 9:23:51 AM
I bought mine in Savannah, Ga in 1990, Its still in the box and the price tag reads 239.00. cant tell you what they sell for now, they arent rare, nice little scopes but better ones exist out there.

Mark
gunnut003  [Member]
5/8/2007 2:39:13 AM
I only bid about $100 on that scope as they are not the best possible, there are the Hakko versions, The company the made some of them for Colt, that are improved upon. The blue labeled ones are assembled in china with Japan parts were as the black lettered ones were assembled in Japan.'
peepshowal  [Member]
5/8/2007 2:10:34 PM

Originally Posted By gunnut003:
there are the Hakko versions, The company the made some of them for Colt, that are improved upon. The blue labeled ones are assembled in china with Japan parts were as the black lettered ones were assembled in Japan.'


Just so I understand, the new blue label Hakko 4 x 21 scopes like these www.cdnninvestments.com/ar4xbdcscwha1.html are made either in japan or china?

Isn't the one in the ebay link above an earlier Hakko 4 x 20 made for Colt in Japan? I think these are the ones that came in a white box with gold Colt lettering.

Thanks to burnm193, gunnut003
gunnut003  [Member]
5/8/2007 8:20:13 PM
The blue label scopes are assembled in China, the Black body ones (I guess either Hakko marked, and Colt marked are assembled in Japan )
captainpooby  [Team Member]
5/9/2007 1:58:49 PM
Wouls this scope have been around pre 1970 and issued?
gunnut003  [Member]
5/9/2007 3:22:23 PM

Originally Posted By captainpooby:
Wouls this scope have been around pre 1970 and issued?


This exact model no, This TYPE of scope (COLT labeled) probably was around in the late sixties as that is when the AR/SP1 rifles came out, but I think they were personally bought, The military didnt seen to field them in large numbers, just soldiers that wanted them, bought them. I think I have seen one picture of a scope on a rifle that looks like in was in Nam, But cant say for sure, I will look for the picture, though (I'll post in 4 hours as I have school now)
captainpooby  [Team Member]
5/9/2007 11:57:47 PM

Originally Posted By gunnut003:

Originally Posted By captainpooby:
Wouls this scope have been around pre 1970 and issued?


This exact model no, This TYPE of scope (COLT labeled) probably was around in the late sixties as that is when the AR/SP1 rifles came out, but I think they were personally bought, The military didnt seen to field them in large numbers, just soldiers that wanted them, bought them. I think I have seen one picture of a scope on a rifle that looks like in was in Nam, But cant say for sure, I will look for the picture, though (I'll post in 4 hours as I have school now)
gunnut003  [Member]
5/10/2007 12:53:57 AM
Sorry for the delay, I got caught up finishing a BMW build...

here are some pictures from the Real Deal thread above.









Bob1984  [Team Member]
5/10/2007 5:44:59 PM
Leapers made a close copy of this scope a couple of years ago.

Link
amd6547  [Member]
5/10/2007 10:37:29 PM
I just bought a Hakko blue label 4x21. It, and the box it came in are marked "made in Japan".
I have had two other knock-off scopes--they worked ok, nothing really wrong with them, but I got rid of them both.
The Hakko is so new that I havn't had a chance to zero it, but I can say that it seems like the highest quality of the bunch.
By the way, I did try the barska colt clone on my recent A1 build. I could put five rounds of Guat 55gn FMJ into about an inch and a half at 100 yards. I was shooting clay pigeons, one shot, one kill.
smoken44  [Member]
5/12/2007 9:45:00 AM
This one is made in japan around 1982. While not as sharp as a Leupold, it is a nice piece of glass. The BDC works as advertised with m193. They have short eye relief though. An A1 or adj stock work best. Around $200 is the going price. The leapers knockoffs are junk.

MattyMattel  [Member]
5/13/2007 10:47:06 AM

Originally Posted By smoken44:
This one is made in japan around 1982. While not as sharp as a Leupold, it is a nice piece of glass. The BDC works as advertised with m193. They have short eye relief though. An A1 or adj stock work best. Around $200 is the going price. The leapers knockoffs are junk.

www.hunt101.com/img/494313-big.jpg
Yep,the Leaper's are Chinese junk(pun intended),good for a cheap retro look only(not worth a damn for holding zero). The original Colt Realistic's are going for $320 and up at the local funshows.
bpunk360  [Member]
5/17/2007 10:28:12 PM
From what i was told by a friend of mine was that the COLT scopes were made from some china or japan company and were offered for purchase when buying a colt rifle for like $50 or $100 but if purchased w/o buying a rifle they were like $150-$200.. after COLT stopped putting their name on them the company decieded to just sell them cheaper under their name.. i purchased one new for $36 (thru a friend who knew a shop owner) but i think there going for like $100.. i havnt been able to sight it in yet but will keep you updated on how it works...
chris65  [Member]
5/22/2007 8:25:22 PM
Thanks for starting this topic! You guys are full of Good Info!!

Went to CDNN and bought one:
http://www.cdnninvestments.com/ar4xbdcscwha1.html

Ekie  [Team Member]
5/22/2007 8:46:46 PM
Hakko made the 1990's Colt 4x21 scopes, and they still make them.

The 1960's 3x20 was made in the USA. The Army bought close to 400 of them for use in Vietnam.

The 1970's and 80's Colt 3x20 and 4x20 scopes were made in Japan, but I do not know who made them.
txsgar15a2  [Member]
5/22/2007 11:31:14 PM
All:
I remember shooting an M16 with a 4X scope while in the USAF Security Police. These were more for "marksman" type duties. It was not a true sniper type of rifle, but it sure beat no optics at all. This only happened once while attending the EST Emergency Services Team school at Lackland AFB in 1987.
gunnut003  [Member]
5/23/2007 1:10:10 AM

Originally Posted By Ekie:
Hakko made the 1990's Colt 4x21 scopes, and they still make them.

The 1960's 3x20 was made in the USA. The Army bought close to 400 of them for use in Vietnam.

The 1970's and 80's Colt 3x20 and 4x20 scopes were made in Japan, but I do not know who made them.


Any way to tell these apart from the Japanese ones?
Ekie  [Team Member]
5/23/2007 9:55:22 AM

Originally Posted By gunnut003:

Originally Posted By Ekie:
Hakko made the 1990's Colt 4x21 scopes, and they still make them.

The 1960's 3x20 was made in the USA. The Army bought close to 400 of them for use in Vietnam.

The 1970's and 80's Colt 3x20 and 4x20 scopes were made in Japan, but I do not know who made them.


Any way to tell these apart from the Japanese ones?


The are marked MADE IN USA. I can post a pic, later....
Blanco_Diablo  [Member]
5/23/2007 10:02:25 AM
Thought this was an interesting pic..not sure of where it is.

Ekie  [Team Member]
5/23/2007 10:35:59 AM
VAAR  [Team Member]
5/23/2007 11:27:22 AM
That really is an interesting pic. I would love to know where that was, and who those guys were.
DakotaFAL  [Member]
5/30/2007 6:15:31 PM
I used a 4x20 Colt scope with a post reticle extensively until about 10 years ago. After 2 moves it is missing in storage somewhere...

I bought two of the Hakko scopes recently and other than the non retro look caused by the adjustment knobs being toward the front of the scope, I like them.

The optics are the same as the optics on my Hakko made Colt scope, and they hold their zeros quite well.

The windage is now externally adjustable and the bullet drop compensator is well regulated to M193 ball just like my Colt scope. A couple weeks ago I was out shooting an M-16A1 clone with one mounted on top and it consistently nailed 1 empty pound propane bottles at 300 yards.

For the $70 each I paid for them, I have no complaints.

I do agree that with the eye relief on them, they work best with an A1 or adjustable stock, unless you have a neck like a giraffe.
tiger222  [Member]
6/28/2007 10:40:26 AM

Originally Posted By Blanco_Diablo:
Thought this was an interesting pic..not sure of where it is.

img442.imageshack.us/img442/8923/f20050221021936000001zq4.jpg


I would guess a somewhere in Central America, most likely a Honduran Military Police Unit on Training.
The M16A1's with the A2 handguard is very indicative of our military assistance to this region. It would also have to be country that has adopted woodland camo, like ours but with the shoulder epelet. The GW1 chocochip camo face masks obviously were "field expediant" and could of come from the special forces advisor's personal kit or what was on hand. The only thing that throws me is the IDF style sling....
GiantCarp  [Member]
6/28/2007 8:38:42 PM

Originally Posted By tiger222:

Originally Posted By Blanco_Diablo:
Thought this was an interesting pic..not sure of where it is.

img442.imageshack.us/img442/8923/f20050221021936000001zq4.jpg


I would guess a somewhere in Central America, most likely a Honduran Military Police Unit on Training.
The M16A1's with the A2 handguard is very indicative of our military assistance to this region. It would also have to be country that has adopted woodland camo, like ours but with the shoulder epelet. The GW1 chocochip camo face masks obviously were "field expediant" and could of come from the special forces advisor's personal kit or what was on hand. The only thing that throws me is the IDF style sling....


Palestinian maybe?
Villafuego  [Team Member]
6/28/2007 9:22:21 PM

Originally Posted By Ekie:
Hakko made the 1990's Colt 4x21 scopes, and they still make them.

The 1960's 3x20 was made in the USA. The Army bought close to 400 of them for use in Vietnam.

The 1970's and 80's Colt 3x20 and 4x20 scopes were made in Japan, but I do not know who made them.


I was always under the assumption that Hakko also made the 3 and 4x scopes for Colt in the 70's / 80's as well.....but have never been able to find anything conclusive.

Lets see if you guys recognise this.....I have 2 on the way....and will post some pics when they show up.

(Hint.....isn't Japanese, and is military issue.....3x20....1960's / 70's)
Blanco_Diablo  [Member]
6/28/2007 9:24:17 PM

Originally Posted By Villafuego:

Originally Posted By Ekie:
Hakko made the 1990's Colt 4x21 scopes, and they still make them.

The 1960's 3x20 was made in the USA. The Army bought close to 400 of them for use in Vietnam.

The 1970's and 80's Colt 3x20 and 4x20 scopes were made in Japan, but I do not know who made them.


I was always under the assumption that Hakko also made the 3 and 4x scopes for Colt in the 70's / 80's as well.....but have never been able to find anything conclusive.

Lets see if you guys recognise this.....I have 2 on the way....and will post some pics when they show up.

(Hint.....isn't Japanese, and is military issue.....3x20)
img.photobucket.com/albums/v239/villafuego/pix445337109.jpg

Armalite?
Villafuego  [Team Member]
6/28/2007 9:33:02 PM
Damn good guess....but no....

The "Armalite" 2.75x made for the AR-180's is almost identical to the Colt 3x except for the markings......and it isn't a Dutch Delft for sure....

It took me a while to figure out exactly what it was before I decided to "pounce" on them.....

Blanco_Diablo  [Member]
6/28/2007 9:46:47 PM
LOL well I have NO IDEA at all and I was just guessing So what is it?

BTW, Villa, I have something on the way that would probably make you mad if I told you what it was and how much I paid for it. Be on the lookout for a thread of mine next week
Villafuego  [Team Member]
6/28/2007 9:51:47 PM
Ok.....but you best fess-up as to what you've got coming........unopened case of waffle mags???????

It's an Israeli Electro Optical Co. (El-Op) "Eyal" 3x20..........
Bama-Shooter  [Team Member]
6/28/2007 9:55:17 PM

Originally Posted By Ekie:
img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/Ekie12091941/optics/coltrealist02.jpg


I'll be damned I have one of those.
fxntime  [Team Member]
6/28/2007 10:30:20 PM




$20.00 a few years ago. Not bad glass actually tho the field of view is sorta small. ASIA optical. 06 hash 08 is in the hard to see last pic.

Didn't get the box.
Ekie  [Team Member]
6/29/2007 12:05:17 AM

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By Ekie:
img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/Ekie12091941/optics/coltrealist02.jpg


I'll be damned I have one of those.


Good deal, I see them sell in the upper $300 range.

Got a request for more pics, so here they are:








Originally Posted By fxntime:
i13.tinypic.com/5xzugc5.jpg
i19.tinypic.com/4p0qc0g.jpg
i12.tinypic.com/6g3nms0.jpg

$20.00 a few years ago. Not bad glass actually tho the field of view is sorta small. ASIA optical. 06 hash 08 is in the hard to see last pic.

Didn't get the box.


Thanks for the pics, I did not think those were Hakkos. Am pretty sure the 4x21 Colt's are Hakkos, along with the Beeman and C-More series.
gunnut003  [Team Member]
6/29/2007 4:23:31 PM

Originally Posted By Villafuego:

Originally Posted By Ekie:
Hakko made the 1990's Colt 4x21 scopes, and they still make them.

The 1960's 3x20 was made in the USA. The Army bought close to 400 of them for use in Vietnam.

The 1970's and 80's Colt 3x20 and 4x20 scopes were made in Japan, but I do not know who made them.


I was always under the assumption that Hakko also made the 3 and 4x scopes for Colt in the 70's / 80's as well.....but have never been able to find anything conclusive.

Lets see if you guys recognise this.....I have 2 on the way....and will post some pics when they show up.

(Hint.....isn't Japanese, and is military issue.....3x20....1960's / 70's)
img.photobucket.com/albums/v239/villafuego/pix445337109.jpg


They are ISRAELI.
Bama-Shooter  [Team Member]
6/29/2007 4:45:20 PM

Originally Posted By Ekie:

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By Ekie:
img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/Ekie12091941/optics/coltrealist02.jpg


I'll be damned I have one of those.


Good deal, I see them sell in the upper $300 range.

Got a request for more pics, so here they are:

img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/Ekie12091941/optics/coltrealist04.jpg

img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/Ekie12091941/optics/coltrealist03.jpg

img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/Ekie12091941/optics/coltrealist01.jpg


Originally Posted By fxntime:
i13.tinypic.com/5xzugc5.jpg
i19.tinypic.com/4p0qc0g.jpg
i12.tinypic.com/6g3nms0.jpg

$20.00 a few years ago. Not bad glass actually tho the field of view is sorta small. ASIA optical. 06 hash 08 is in the hard to see last pic.

Didn't get the box.


Thanks for the pics, I did not think those were Hakkos. Am pretty sure the 4x21 Colt's are Hakkos, along with the Beeman and C-More series.



The BDC on mine is broken. Do you know anyone who repairs those scopes?
msweet16  [Member]
6/30/2007 4:53:54 PM

Originally Posted By Ekie:
Hakko made the 1990's Colt 4x21 scopes, and they still make them.

The 1960's 3x20 was made in the USA. The Army bought close to 400 of them for use in Vietnam.

The 1970's and 80's Colt 3x20 and 4x20 scopes were made in Japan, but I do not know who made them.


I have a 3x with the Standard Colt type logo. Is it Jap made? I got it second hand. Any way to tell?
afe7ret  [Team Member]
7/1/2007 1:38:18 AM
I ordered one of the Hakko scopes from CDNN the other day. If it's not Japanese and high quality it's going back. Already got screwed once on a Leaper's POS. We'll see...
Villafuego  [Team Member]
7/1/2007 1:47:51 PM
Some pics of the Eyal scope.....has definitely seen use, but has outrageously clear and crisp optics. Weighs substantially more than a Colt 3-4x....will see how it does next week....



Model_One  [Team Member]
7/3/2007 12:06:45 PM
I have one of the "Made in USA" Colt scopes - anybody know the history, such as when in the sixties these were made and by whom, and whether they would be more appropriate on an M16, E1, A1?

Mine looks like it has seen some use, but not abuse, and it has the original lens caps.
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