AR15.Com Archives
 30 and 40 round magazines for the DPMS LR-308/Knight style rifle
HumanoidTyphoon  [Member]
2/28/2010 5:50:30 PM
Just wanted to let everyone know that Armageddon Magazines makes 30 and 40 round magazines for DPMS and similair style rifles. The web site is www.armageddonmag.com. Here are some photos.






ARhabit  [Team Member]
2/28/2010 8:05:58 PM
$100 is too pricey!I don't like the smooth sides either.My $0.02.
JohnInPA  [Member]
2/28/2010 8:13:53 PM
I believe C products will have only a 25 rounder available soon
ARhabit  [Team Member]
2/28/2010 8:18:21 PM
Originally Posted By JohnInPA:
I believe C products will have only a 25 rounder available soon


Shipping April........I hope.
CProductsChad  [Industry Partner]
3/1/2010 8:28:02 AM
Originally Posted By ARhabit:
Originally Posted By JohnInPA:
I believe C products will have only a 25 rounder available soon


Shipping April........I hope.





April is the plan.

Chad
TonyRumore  [Member]
3/1/2010 10:04:50 AM
I'll pass on the big donkey dick hanging off the bottom of my gun.

thebrassnuckles  [Team Member]
3/1/2010 2:59:52 PM
looks like you could use that thing as a melee weapon.
daxifus  [Member]
3/1/2010 4:01:06 PM
Originally Posted By HumanoidTyphoon:



That is just ridiculous. Throw out your shooting sticks with that thing!

And why would they even have a bipod on a rifle with a mag that long on it, counterbalance?
HumanoidTyphoon  [Member]
3/1/2010 7:38:57 PM
I need to apologize. I was unaware that C-Mag was a industry partner to ar15.com. I didn't mean to interfere with the C-Mag push, but as can you see they are not 25 round magazines. That being said. If you are uncomfortable with the longer 40 round magazines, feel they look like a donkeys' dick, think you should use them as a weapon or feel they will be to heavy for you, you could look at the smaller 30 round magazines. I understand a 40 round magazine isn't for everyone, but some people like a little more capacity in their magazines (That is why the military issues 30 round magazines-not 20s) By the way, there are comparison photos of an AR-15 side by side with the DPMS in both the 30 and 40 round configurations on the web site. The magazines are not out of line for the size of the rifle. I would think that you might be excited about another size magazine for the DPMS LR-308. It is a great weapon and has only had one short coming - and that is magazine capacity.
sgunn911  [Member]
3/1/2010 9:48:17 PM
I really don't think the comments had anything to do with some affiliation of AR-15.com and anybody, it's just the initial shock of seeing the pictures. I have to admit the bi-pod remark was pretty funny, why not just add a rubber cap to the magazine and viola: instant mono-pod! Actually, if you want to compare, a more comperable side-by-side could be the Saiga 12 platform and some of the magazines they have produced for that thing (and sold a crapload of them as well). Those things carry enough 12 guage rounds to turn a man into a pile of mush!

I agree that it is about time for a larger capacity magazine to finally be ready. POF announced their 25 round .308 magazine over a year ago and started taking orders (and money, I know I ordered a couple) and STILL are saying they are finishing up with testing, which is the same response I got over a year ago when I contacted them about my order. RRA also has one but it doesn't fit the majority of AR-10's out there.

Do you happen to know why this magazine is so large? It maybe a opical illusion, but it looks like the 30 round magazine is the size of two 20 round mags end to end. Is there a reason for the end to be at that much of an angle? I don't see how it could benifit the spring travel and it adds quite a bit of length?

Also, the drawback you mentioned is a double -edged sword, higher capacity magazines in this caliber are going to be super heavy. If you recall it is one reason the US originally chose the 5.56 round for the new m-16 battle rifle. The troops could carry over twice the ammo over the older M-14's and other rifles in the US arsenal. It is also the reason I was told POF and C-products chose a maximum of 25 rounds for their new magazines, anything more was starting to add a lot of weight to the weapon. I wonder what one of those massive 40 round mags weigh full?

I for one appreciate the post, I like seeing what's going on out there whether I am going to buy one or not. I am sure this magazine has it's niches, unfortunately it won't be hunting or anything requiring carrying your rifle around for any distance. The weight is too much and the magazine sticks out enough to catch on every possible obstruction I deal with while out and about. My POF P-308 loaded up already weighs more than I would like and seems to gain weight as the hours tick by while carrying it.

Thanks for the post

HumanoidTyphoon  [Member]
3/1/2010 11:32:06 PM
First- I want to say thanks for being civil. No profanity or anything. Just one wise crack about a monopod.

Next, I really didn't want to get into the 223 vs 308 discussion, especially since they don't want me to on this site, but the military has had many short falls with the 223 and have been playing around with other calibers to make up for these short comings. That being said, there is no free lunch. Yes the guns and ammo will weigh more, yes you will have more recoil, but the 308 will do things that the 223 will not. You are right about not hunting with the magazines or walking around the woods with them. That isn't what high capacity magazines are for. We all know that. That is why they are always trying to take them from us.

You mentioned ordering the magazines from POF and you say the reason they haven't gotten them to you is because they are still working out the bugs. So it seems to me that the weight of the 25 rounds is not the issue, but the feeding of the rounds.

As for the weight issue and the length. I know that Beta Cs' drum mags for the 223 are heavier then the 40 round magazine for the DPMS and the 48 round stick mags for the 223 are only three inches shorter then the 40 round magazines for the DPMS . So my question is...What happened when we bought the 308s? Does the gun weigh so much that we can't afford to carry any ammo with it? or have we become so accustomed to seeing the little 20 rounders under them that anything with any capacity looks out of place? The 30 round magazine looks like a 40 round 223 and no one says anything about them. I would recomend everyone just look at the web site. It will answer all your questions and there are a lot of pictures so you can see exactly how everything works and I understand not everyone needs or wants something like this. I just wanted everyone to know that they were available.

1gewehr  [Member]
3/2/2010 11:18:58 AM
I am always interested to see new products for my rifles. I do have a few questions:
1) How do you disassemble the magazines for cleaning? With that welded baseplate, it seems difficult to clean.
2) Why such a radical angle to the bottom? The 30rd straight mags made for the HK and FAL don't have such a sharp angle.
3) Why did you do without the rear rib? It seems that using a molded rear tab on the follower would have been simpler (and cheaper) for activating the bolt hold-open.

Thanks! I look forward to seeing full-auto mag dumps from one or two of these at Knob Creek next month!
ghound  [Member]
3/2/2010 12:20:32 PM
so, how long before we see a post on you tube of someone trying to bump shot a 308 with one of those mags in it?

HumanoidTyphoon  [Member]
3/2/2010 3:24:03 PM
Those are the questions I was expecting at first. I have wanted to do a youtube video. I just haven't had the time yet, but I will make sure I get one up soon. I really don't like video taping myself, but it is needed and understandably. I don't know if we will be able to make it to Knobb Creek. I am one of the lucky people still working and the magazines were done on the side. So I need to keep my job.

Now for the questions. We load the spring and follower through the top of the mag. It really is simple to do and I will make sure I show it on youtube.
As for the angle. We played with that a lot. At first we had the standard angle that is on the DPMS mags, but we were finding that (especially with the 40 rounders) when the mag was loaded fully the last round tended to ride with the nose a little low. This would sometimes cause the bullet to hang up on the magazine when the bolt was closed. So by increasing the angle we caused the spring to load faster in the nose and it gave us a more reliable first or last round, however you look at it. I am not really sure how HK and FAL got around the issue we had and to be honest I haven't seen one of their magazines. I have seen an AR-10 mag and they did some strange things with the way their mag is laid out. The entire magazine is on an angle. I will also tell you that the spring in these magazines is nothing like DPMSs. This spring is huge. Both in length and thickness. The guy that makes the springs told me that standard code for the 6 axis cnc machine, that makes these springs, is 40 lines and this spring uses 140 .So it takes up a lot of room in the bottom of the mag. The last question about the tab spring in the rear of the mag was another one of the trial and error things we had to work through. Yes if we would have stamped 22 gauge steel and put the back rib in it we could have gotten away with the standard plastic tabbed follower. We instead used 18 gauge steel on these magazines for a couple of reasons. The 18 gauge steel is twice as thick as the 22 gauge and it limited us in two areas. One was the inside diameter of the magazine. The other was the back rib. Because the steel is so thick you couldn't put the rib in it and still have room to have the plastic tab on the follower. We knew we wanted the bolt to lock back (because in my opinion if it doesn't the magazine is worse then useless) so we worked out the stainless spring. I hope this helps and I will get that youtube video up as soon as I can.
Forest  [Team Member]
3/2/2010 4:13:30 PM



<Ace Bigalow>
That's a BIG bitch!
</Ace Bigalow>

Ok I can see a use in 3 gun. But I have a few questions/comments.

1) WHY are the magazine floorplates welded shut? It's going to be hard to clean the magazine and impossible to replace magazine springs.

2) Ok they used a heavy gauges steel (possibly so they didn't have to flute the sides?), but requiring a reduction in COAL is NOT a good thing. The 6.8 guys spend twice as much to get PRIs (over C Products) just so they get the extra .05" for loading heavier/longer bullets.

and I note in their pack they are working on a way to carry 12-18 magazines ready in a 'Battle Pack'!? DAMN that would be heavy - that's more ammo than individual squad members carry to support a M60.

Anyone else note they didn't highlight Ohio in their Legal Disclaimer? (more than 31 in OH is considered a machinegun...)

ETA: Just read the post above - I'm looking forward to the YouTube video.
LtBlue425  [Team Member]
3/2/2010 4:23:44 PM
Always interested in new developments and inventions but for .308 size cases a 20 rd mag is plenty for me.
osprey21  [Life Member]
3/2/2010 4:37:33 PM
BiggiBen  [Member]
3/2/2010 5:23:28 PM
I want to publicly thank this company for being innovative and bringing another product to the table.

For those complaining about the price tag, I remember when all my KAC 20 round magazines were $100 USED.




Now, I personally dont know if I will buy either of these magazines, as it is widely known that zombies travel in packs of 19.....

TANKBUILDER  [Member]
3/2/2010 9:46:53 PM
Some people are too creative.
HumanoidTyphoon  [Member]
3/2/2010 10:00:40 PM
I want to say thanks for going all the way through the web site.

The spring and follower will easily pull through the top. I personally have never taken a floor plate off a magazine to clean it, change a spring or anything else- Not to say you can't, but that would be difficult with ours. Sorry

We didn't want to limit the OAL but we are talking about .035. and for most applications on a magazine of this size I can't see it hurting anything. I completely understand you mentioning it though and we fought really hard to keep these inside dimensions as big as we could. We made sure we mentioned it because I didn't want any confusion about the mags.

Yes, the battle pack would be a lot of ammunition, but I don't feel that 50 or so pounds is out of line. I didn't realize that was more ammo then the squad members carried for the M-60... that ROCKS. The pack was just an idea to help find a place to put a bunch of magazines and because the mags are straight not curved they will lend themselves to stacking and carrying a bunch of them with ease. Of course you don't have to.

As for Ohio. Please do not expect me to keep track of all of the gun laws in every state, but we will update it for you.

I will get the video up for you guys soon.

Thanks everyone.
Forest  [Team Member]
3/3/2010 2:49:46 AM
Originally Posted By HumanoidTyphoon:
.We didn't want to limit the OAL but we are talking about .035. and for most applications on a magazine of this size I can't see it hurting anything.

Did you compare it by chance with a 155gr AMAX? It's one of the 'better' defensive rounds in that caliber and the polymere tipped bullets tend to be longer than usual. That would be the biggest concern IMHO

Yes, the battle pack would be a lot of ammunition, but I don't feel that 50 or so pounds is out of line.

Not for a range trip - I'd never try to carry that if I had to worry about other things (like food, water, a PRC-77..)


I didn't realize that was more ammo then the squad members carried for the M-60... that ROCKS.
.
When I was in many moons ago it was 1 .30 cal can per person (200 rounds). Even at the low end of your range you're way beond that.
HumanoidTyphoon  [Member]
3/4/2010 8:16:19 PM
I like the A-max bullet too, but I prefer the bigger 168s. And you are correct, they would be too long to fit in the mag. if you seated them to spec or bought them off of the shelf. I just seat mine in a little further and they would be fine. Some ting I have noticed with the polymer typed bullets in the mag fed weapon is the tips get deformed by the recoil. I actually switched back to boat tailed bullets because of it.

I originally posted this just so every one would know it was out there and I think that this goal has been met. So if any one has any questions please call my cell on the web site or drop me an email and I will answer any other questions that any one has.

Thanks.
CurtisLR  [Member]
3/5/2010 3:09:49 AM
you can own 30+ mags in ohio. they just cant be inserted in non-nfa weapons. your g2g in ohio you can buy 30+ round all day
chris65  [Team Member]
3/5/2010 7:31:33 PM
Interesting design - seem to be built tank-tough.
Can we see some pics of how to disassemble the mag, which would show the spring and follower?
And is there a lower "follower" or some-such inside at the base?
Any plans to offer a swiss-cheesed version for ligher weight for the competition guys?
FYI - most of Illinois (101 out of 102 counties) does *not* have a magazine capacity limit law.
GlockSlap  [Member]
3/8/2010 8:39:35 AM
I would go for a 30 rounder if it had a more traditional look to it...
HumanoidTyphoon  [Member]
3/8/2010 10:34:16 PM
I am sorry I haven't gotten back on here sooner. We have some videos that we will have on You Tube shortly that will show the magazine, follower and main spring. We also have a video of the rapid fire.

I am afraid that if we put the holes in the magazine that the spring might cause us some problems. This spring is pretty stiff and it might flex the sides enough to cause jamming issues. We had even debated on offering the magazines in aluminum, to lighten them up a bit. But I don't know that little difference in weight is going to make that big of a difference. The magazines are naturally heavier then other stick magazines, but they don't feel awkward in the gun and I don't really notice the extra weight.

I want to let everyone know that we didn't set out to make a magazine that looks different then everyone elses for the sake of it. We fought with the feeding issues on these magazines for some time and found that this design allowed us to feed all of the rounds and keep the magazine straight. We wanted a design that would let you carry multiple spare magazines in a relatively small space.

And I want to thank everyone for the impute on the different states. The sad thing is we all live in the United States and we all should be able to buy these or any other magazine made. I will let everyone know as soon as i finish up these videos and get them posted.


HumanoidTyphoon  [Member]
3/12/2010 11:08:01 AM
Hey Guys! My husband asked me to post the link for the video for you. We will be working on some more videos addressing some of the other questions posted above. We apologize for the quality of the video- but I think you can still get the idea. Thank you!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRkMqdOVrao





thebrassnuckles  [Team Member]
3/12/2010 1:00:52 PM
lots of big bullets really fast!
i like it!!!